Israel-Palestine, A Conversation (Part I)

A note from the Editor

The Hamas attack on October 7th and the Israeli response have been sources of  outrage and   despair.  We at Interwoven Congregations considered issuing a statement, but then decided instead to use our Quarterly publication  to probe the issues more deeply.  To do so, we reached out to two people, Rev. Sari Ateek of St. John’s Norwood Episcopal Church, a Palestinian native, and Rabbi Abbi Sharofsky of the Jewish Community Relations Council of Greater Washington. We had interviewed Rabbi Abbi for an earlier Quarterly issue on Anti-Bigotry.  And I knew Rev. Sari from my time in Bethesda, MD and had a deep appreciation for his ministry. What I didn’t realize is that Sari and Abbi also knew each other.  So we sat down (over Zoom) on Feb. 6th for a very personal, challenging, painful but also inspiring conversation about what they felt, what they thought, what they hope, and what role they think people of faith should play today   regarding Israel-Palestine.

We are going to post the Quarterly issue in 5 parts, one each day this week. If you wish, you can read the whole issue all at once here. Thank you for  reading with an open heart.

Peace, salaam, shalom,      -  Rev. Pat Jackson

PART 1: How did you FEEL?

Rev. Pat Jackson, Interwoven Congregations:  Rev. Sari Ateek and Rabbi Abbi Sharofsky, thank you for joining us for this conversation today (February 6th) about the recent events in Israel - Palestine.  Sari, if I could start with you, how did you feel on October 7th and in the aftermath?

Rev. Sari Ateek, St. John’s Norwood Episcopal Church:  Thank you, this is a beautiful [conversation] space. I was really sad when I heard the news of October 7th.   I was shocked, actually, at the magnitude of it.  There's never been in my lifetime any situation where Israelis were killed in those numbers. It is not uncommon for Palestinians to be killed in those numbers, but for Israelis to be killed in those numbers was truly a shocking thing.  I was sad and I was also disturbed by my own lack of surprise that there would be such a reaction from Hamas to the state of oppression in  Gaza.  My theory about humans is that the human spirit has to thrive. It has to live.  And so there's never a situation where people are going to be okay living in confinement like that. So there's a lack of      surprise that there would be some spillover from Gaza.  Part of the sadness for me is that the cycle of violence continues.  So the reaction to the events that came afterwards is also not a surprise.  We see this everywhere: “You attack us, we will make you pay.” I just wish humans weren't so  predictable.   So no surprise with Israel’s response.

Pat: Abbi, how about for you? How did you feel?

Rabbi Abbi Sharofsky, Jewish Community Relations Council of Greater Washington:  It  happened on the end of the holiday of Sukkot, on these two holy days, Sh'mini Atzeret and Simchat Torah, when we celebrate the end of the   Torah reading cycle for the whole year.  There's a lot of joy and celebration.  You wouldn't typically use electronics so I try to stay off my phones.  I        remember waking up that Saturday morning [of October 7th] and my phone was just buzzing.  I saw that it was a group chat that I'm in with Jews and Catholics.  We had spent a week together in an emerging leadership program.  A Catholic priest in a Hebrew-speaking church in Jerusalem was messaging, “We’re okay, I can't believe this is happening.”  And I thought, “What happened to Father Benny?”   And then I start looking through the feed and I'm like, “Oh my God.”  I just couldn't believe it. I'm sitting in bed and I tap my husband,  “David, something's happened.” And I just start scrolling through -- 600 Israelis, 700 Israelis. And the number just kept going up.  We didn't want to say anything to our two kids;  they’re 12 and 8.  We went to synagogue that morning, and people were finding out.  And everyone was saying, “Are you okay?  Is this person okay? Is that person okay?”  And then finally, we get to the part in the Torah service where you say a prayer for the State of Israel and a prayer for this country.  Our rabbi broke the news from the bima.  I remember saying the prayer for Israel.  The rabbi recited the prayer for the soldiers, and our cantor sang a song for those who were captives.  We had heard that the nephew of someone in our congregation had been taken hostage.  I remember the cantor singing a beautiful song that I learned years ago.  I was singing it and just crying; and I'm not a crier in synagogue.  Afterwards, we were all saying “How are you?” “Well, you know.”  That became the greeting line for the next few weeks.

I remember this gut feeling upon seeing what happened -- Hamas had attacked these kibbutzim, there were rockets everywhere -- and my instinct was that the antisemitism is going to go sky high.  Islamophobia is going to go sky high.  This is going to be  really bad for our kids.

Then in the days to come, I remember just holding my breath.  Is there going to be a ground invasion? When is it going to happen?  This is going to be bad.  Two of my colleagues in the JCRC office have sons who are currently in the  IDF (Israel Defense Forces).  They were among the first to go into Gaza.  I remember this terrible feeling of “I can't believe we're doing this, and I hope their sons come home.  There's no way this is going to be good for anyone at all.”  I hate that this is where we are.

Pat:  Sari, I wonder if you might say a word about your own background and how you connect with this situation.  How did you interact with your   congregation following these events initially?

Sari:  It was a weird space for me.  Abbi, you're in a community full of Jewish people, right?  So everyone is feeling that impact in a very personal way. For me, I'm the only Palestinian around Americans in my church.  So all of the focus of the situation in Gaza is put on me, like “What's happening over there?”  So I actually retreated emotionally. I did not want to be around anyone. I didn't want to be the poster child for what's happening there.   I couldn’t take care of people's

feelings while I   myself was grieving.  I just couldn't be there for people in that way.  I think October was probably the hardest month for me.  I cried like I've never cried before.  I wasn’t just crying for the tremendous loss of life in Gaza;  I was crying because now I can’t even imagine there ever being peace in my lifetime.  I wasn't planning on saying anything about it from the pulpit [on    Oct. 15th].  I kept putting off writing the sermon, and then I realized that I couldn't preach on anything that was going to feel even remotely        authentic  unless I spoke about what was actually going on for me.  And so I decided to just let the congregation in on how I was  processing where God is in the midst of this. That was it.  I don't have   answers, just  “Here's how I'm processing it.”

I centered my sermon around a prayer that I've had in my Bible for a really long time. It's an anonymous prayer that is simply attributed with “based on the prayer of a Palestinian Christian.”  I've had it in my Bible since I was a kid, and it reads: “Pray not for Palestinian or Jew, for Arab or Israeli, but rather pray for ourselves that we might not divide them in our prayers, but keep them together in our hearts.”  The congregation found the sermon meaningful - particularly the ending  where I said that when    people say to me, “I'm pro-Palestinian,” I always respond by saying, “Please don't be.”  I know you’re trying to tell me that you are in solidarity with my people, but the last thing we need is for people to be pro-Palestinian and pro-Israeli.  That's where the problem is -- saying I am for one group of people.  We have to be pro-justice. We have to be pro-humanity.  Abbi, you have eyes and ears and you're looking at me, and your soul is so beautiful.  There's nothing that's different between you and me. We're human beings with a desire for our people to thrive.  We all have the right to nationhood and to self-determination.  It doesn't have to be zero sum. And so I don't believe in saying, “I am blindly supportive of this group or that.” I think if we could elevate ourselves and speak out about injustice when injustice happens, then we're going to be much better contributors to the human family.

I eventually emerged out of that depression.  As a Palestinian who was born and raised in Israel-Palestine, I developed amazing skills for compartmentalization.  So it wasn't even a conscious thing.  My nervous system just made a switch in the beginning of November.  Maybe it's not healthy, but I just compartmentalized it.  But it is still emotionally very difficult for me.

   _________________________________

 Part II resumes tomorrow: What did you THINK? How did we get here with Israel-Palestine?

The Work for Racial Justice and Healing Continues!

2023 was an active year for Interwoven Congregations!  Your support enabled us to host antiracism trainings, support partnerships between congregations, publish a special series on Doing Racial Justice in the Quarterly, complete a tech audit of our organization (watch for our new web site in the New Year!), organize a civil rights pilgrimage, and more!  As we know there’s much to do in the coming year to help equip congregations to be agents for racial justice and healing.  Will you make a year-end donation to make that possible?    Thank  you!

Doing Racial Justice in the Heartland

Topeka JUMP supporters gathered for a "Nehemiah Action Assembly" to press for racial justice.

Rev. Pat Jackson, Interwoven Congregations Quarterly (ICQ): Anton Ahrens and Jason Maymon, thank you for joining us for this interview about how congregations are DOING racial justice in Topeka, Kansas. How and why did Topeka Jump get started?

Anton Ahrens (Topeka JUMP and Trinity Presbyterian Church): I was here 10 years ago when the first organizer from DART (Direct Action and Resource Training Center), Shanae’ Calhoun, came to Topeka. She had meetings with clergy and lay people in faith communities around Shawnee county and found that there was interest in doing justice through the DART process. Then we had a planning meeting where we looked at the call to do biblical justice with people from 10 or 11 faith communities. Now we've grown to about 28 churches.

ICQ: What’s DART’s approach?

Jason Maymon (Topeka JUMP): DART’s approach is to bring congregations of various faiths in a community together to identify what community problems need to be addressed. Those problems are identified through stories we collect from members of the community. After problems are identified, the community votes on what issue they want to focus on. Then they'll conduct research with policymakers and community partners to identify the best viable solution. They then present that solution to the appropriate decision maker in what we call Nehemiah Action Assemblies, which are big assemblies with a large chunk of the population of the community. So listen for problems, research the problem, organize to prompt action, and then follow-up.

ICQ: What were the problems lifted up in Topeka?

Anton: Most every year for the past ten years we've lifted up a new campaign from that listening process. Our first campaign was to ask the public schools to make sure kids had access to services like food after school and on weekends and materials for schools. There were about 750 people in attendance at our Nehemiah meeting to watch that exchange with the superintendent of schools here in Topeka. We've also had campaigns to increase the stock of affordable housing, support mental health, anti-violence, and a transportation campaign to help people get to living wage jobs by providing door-to-door service from home to work and back for a minimal charge.

ICQ: How did that campaign work out?

Anton: The Joint Economic Development Organization of Shawnee County and Topeka receives $5 million annually to give incentives to big employers. And we said: “Can we have a little slice of that pie? We could finance this transportation program with $100,000 a year.” That was approved and over the course of three years people took 45,000 rides to work or back home, door to door, for $5 one way. But then the county said “We don't have money in our budget next year for this pilot” and it was cancelled. These are the ups and downs in this work. But since then, the city has stood up a new program that's very much like our ride-to-work program where in a segment of southeast Topeka you can ride anywhere, door-to-door, for two bucks. I think Topeka JUMP’s action moved this community to reimagine what transportation can be. I doubt otherwise whether that would have happened.

ICQ: That's impressive. I'm struck that every year there's an opportunity to identify a new issue. Do you set aside the project from the previous year or is there follow-up?

Topeka JUMP members advocating for affordable housing.

Jason: Once we pick up a campaign, even if we vote on a new one the next year, we don't drop one until we get what we're looking for. For example, we've been working on that affordable housing campaign for eight years.

ICQ: How can congregations engage with DART to become an affiliate like Topeka JUMP?

Jason: A group of clergy can invite DART’s national staff to come and assist them in building an organization, and that assistance usually comes with grants. People can go on the DART website and email our executive director, John Aeschbury. The only restriction is that DART tries to not plant an affiliate where there's already another interfaith organization doing this kind of work.

ICQ: What’s the structure of Topeka JUMP? And Jason, are you a Topeka JUMP or a DART employee?

Jason: I'm an organizer with Topeka JUMP and DART is the national affiliate that we rely on for training. There are three organizers working for Topeka JUMP today.

Anton: I’m one of the two co-chairs of Topeka JUMP. Then every participating faith community has a number of leaders whose job is to recruit what we call “network members” who agree to bring at least three other people to the Nehemia meeting. That’s key because that's what builds our people power, having a lot of people listening when we ask the public official to take an action on one of our campaigns.

Topeka JUMP supporters rallying for affordable housing.

ICQ: What’s the budget for Topeka Jump this year and what are your fund sources?

Anton: It's about $250,000. About 35% comes from congregations, 25% from companies, and the remainder comes from grants. We didn’t have nearly the budget when we started up with one organizer.

ICQ: How many congregational members take part in the DART training?

Anton: I think we've gotten about 100 congregational leaders over the years to go to at least one training. I've been to seven myself. The trainings cover how to do investment meetings with companies when we ask for support, and research meetings with public officials where we’re seeking their agreement to come to the Nehemiah Assembly. Then we’re trained on how you negotiate with the public officials during the Nehemiah Assembly. One Topeka JUMP leader is on the stage with the public official, asking the question: “Will you provide a program to get people more housing in Topeka by putting money into the affordable housing trust fund?” You just stop and let them answer and then you negotiate. Dart provides training to do that in front of thousands of people which, as you can imagine, is kind of stressful.

ICQ: That sounds intimidating.

Anton: I’ve done it twice. It is intimidating, but it's also freeing because even though you're just an individual on the stage asking the question, you've got these masses of people in front of you who the public official also feels, which makes a difference in how they respond.

ICQ: Have you ever had a Nehemiah Assembly where the public official says, “I'll get back to you on that.”

Anton: Of course! We call them “the Ds” -- Divert, Delay. So during the Nehemiah Assembly, we acknowledge the official’s response and then bridge back to our ask, while trying to engage that public official’s self-interest. “Don't you think that housing in Topeka is in a critical state and we need more?” Let them decide if they're going to answer that, yes or no. It's not rocket science, but it's very effective.

ICQ: So some years the official on stage says “Yes, I'll do it” and other years they don’t make a commitment. Is that a failure, or a time for follow up?

Anton: It’s all in the follow-up. Even if they say yes, that yes might not be yes! So we have to be clear about what they've said yes for. Our housing campaign is the best example. In 2015, we asked the official on stage, “Will you start an affordable housing trust fund for Topeka?” And they said “Yes.” But then it took two years just to get an ordinance written so the city could create an account. That was 2018. And here we are in 2023, and they have only put $500,000 in that fund when their own housing study concluded that they need $50 million to make a dent in our housing shortage. We continue to have conversations back and forth. For me it’s a good illustration of the peaks and valleys because you get that “yes” and you think “Oh great,” but then you do the work — and that takes a while.

ICQ: What have been the biggest accomplishments and challenges for Topeka JUMP?

Anton: We've provided justice for Topeka / Shawnee County. We haven’t had victories where we got everything we wanted, but we've moved the dial. People know about these issues and that there are people ready to act on them. That’s huge. And then we have developed community across racial and other barriers which is fantastic.

Jason: I'm amazed by the relationships that have been built. Having such a diverse group of people with different beliefs and backgrounds coming together because they're united around making their community better is amazing. Then I think the biggest challenge, particularly for our longer campaigns, is to make sure that people don't lose hope. But we just have to remember that justice takes a lot longer than most of us would like. But I think it's important to keep going because I think God calls us to do this work and God’s going to continue it after we're gone.

Anton: I've talked with many people who were in tears when we've not been successful. But I also remember Micah 6:8, which is, to paraphrase, “do justice now.” That's the point. It's not your responsibility to complete the task, but it is your responsibility to make sure it continues. Topeka JUMP has given me the opportunity to live out my faith in doing justice in a way that I never would have been able to through any single faith community; and that's been a really great gift to me.

[This interview was part of the October 2023 Interwoven Congregations Quarterly on "Congregations Doing Racial Justice." Catch the full issue here.]